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astrolivier76
Posts: 6
Hi,

I'm an user of Simvim and I'have made a lot of modules based on multiplexer. I know that you prefer use a lot of mega but I prefere minimize the usb connections. I fly on a portable pc and it"s a family pc, so I must to do a system easy to move ^^

long time I have fly with x plane but with the future release of pmdg I would like to try this plane with my modules.
So, you will understand that it's not possible to do new modules.
I can't create two cockpit for two games!!

And finally, I konw that you have already answered to this question but do yoy have an idea when the multiplexer support will possible?

thank you for your response and

THANKS for you job... really appreciate

Olivier
2022-04-21 11:34
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pizman82
Moderator
From: ETSI, Germany
Posts: 5501
Supporter
Hi

About Basic intention.
I understand for sure you like to use your current ( SimVim based) Hardware 1:1 with Mobiflight. Thats logical.
But the argument of " Be portable" is no factor here. Also a hardware with 20 Megas is not more difficult as yours.
You simply use a USB Hub and connect there all Megas.... Then you finally have same like in your system just one single Cable that must be connect or reconnect to move your Cockpit away from Computer.

About Multiplexers.

Meanwhile we support the SimVim Guys by implement Output Shifter and Input Shifters within the last releases.
Also "Multiplexer" are available in the next Beta Release. ( System currently is tested in a close Alpha .... And will released as Beta next time)

BUT
Our Multiplexer Logic is planed for Buttons Only. So SimVim Stuff like controll 7Seg with Multiplexers or the base logic to handle multiple Arduinos as clients via one BAse Hub Arduino that is connected to computer.... this is not in planing for us.


Sounds hard.... We like to make a lot of things possible to the SimVim Users and allow them a easy start with MF.... We try to implement some new things so your hardware is more compatible. But we not fully change our logics to be compatible with SimVim. At the end some rework of Hardware will be needed to fit the MF requirments.
Good Luck !
2022-04-21 15:44
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astrolivier76
Posts: 6
Thanks for your response.
it's cool to read yours intentions.

So, for me the numbers of mega is not the problem.
the problem is that all my modules are solder to the multiplexers and it's a very big job that to remake.
And made an other cockpit in my home is impossible for me!! 2 piece of each modules it's crazy,
Maybe I will stay on x plane 11 / 12.

So, in my case, for resume, if I take a mcp like as exemple:

1) all my switches (boutton on off or momentaries) are connected to 2 multiplexers
2) my 6 encoders (for displays) are connected to an other multiplexer
3) my 6 displays max7219 modules 7 segments 8 digit are connected to an multiplexer
4) all my led are connected to 2 shift register 74HC595 in serial

So, if I understand your message, the only thing to do is disconnect my displays from my pcb and directy to connect to the mega.
the rest are ok with the futur beta

it's exact?
if you want and if we can to post image, i can to show schema and pictures of the module in exemple.

thanks you very much.

Olivier
2022-04-22 08:34
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astrolivier76
Posts: 6
Ok,

So, I've looked how to do to re-wiring my module for a compatibility with simvim old config.
I have some questions:

in the configuration for a simvim module, there is 8 pins are not alloawed:
4 pin: 22 to 25 for the adress bus, it's a 4 wire bus,
4 pin: 26 to 29 for output control signals named S, L, D, T

question 1:

Today, my 6 max7219 displays are independants:
the 3 pins for control are:
DIN, CS and CLK.
On each module I have a commun bus which they are L (CS) and D (DIN) so on the pin 27 and 28
the pins CLK from each module are connected to 6 pin on a multiplexer.
If I want to convert to mobiflight I must to disconnect they from the multplexer to the Mega.

So, I can to wiring in serial my 6 modules and have a only CLK wire? and on the configuration I can choose 6 modules and i can to select all my digit

exact?


Question 2:

Also, the bus L and D are use for control my shift register for led.
So, in the mobiflight is impossible to choose the same pin for 2 configurations

in the furur beta release is it possible?

thanks

Olivier
2022-04-22 13:18
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pizman82
Moderator
From: ETSI, Germany
Posts: 5501
Supporter
Hi again....

At first.... I have no knowledge about the details of the new "Multiplexer" Tool. I not use it for myself.... I fully work still with the system to use one pin for each Element. ( My final Cockpit planings include 50+ Megas)

So for detailed information i high recommend to join our Discord.
there are users like Jaime, Neil and Tuomas who are "fans" of this technics.... Some parts of the codes are from these users !
They pretty sure can awnser your questions !

About basic stuff.....

For LED we also allow Shift Register meanwhile. But in case i not use them i not know if "74HC595" is the supported one. I think so but i´m not sure.

For 7Seg we have a simple logic.
1. Only MAx7219 Based Chips are supported.
2. We allow up to 4 Max Systems on one Mega .... and each System can include up to 8 Max Chips .
So 4x8=32 Chips 32*8=256 Diggits per Mega.
3. Each Max Device ( Whatever a Single Chip or a chain 2-8 Chips) need 3 Pins... One CLK, one DIN and one CS.
So 8 Chips need a minimum of 3 Pins ..... 32 Chips need finally 12 Pins.
In MF the CLK is NOT shared.... Each Device (or Chain) need its own CLK.


At Last.... Sebastian said ( i ask him related to your request) that "Buttons" are possible with Multiplexers.
I expect logical also Switches will be.
For Encoders i have no Information !
Good Luck !
2022-04-23 00:54
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elral
From: near EDDL, Germany
Posts: 28
Encoders do not work with the multiplexer.
They must be wired directly to the Arduino pins.
2022-04-24 09:44
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astrolivier76
Posts: 6
Hi,

thanks for all responses.

After look all the possibilities, it seems that it's not possible to have 1 module for 2 simultators, one for FS2020 and the other for x-plane.

So, I will see if i make just one module MCP for FS2020 and PMDG 737 and I keep all others modules with x-plane and Zibo (maybe for x-plane 12)

have a nice day

Olivier
2022-04-25 13:55
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pizman82
Moderator
From: ETSI, Germany
Posts: 5501
Supporter
You can do.

Alternate is using your "Mobiflight" Setup for Both.
We can also controll the Zibo and Xplane.
Just in a little more advanced logic like SimVim do.
So technical there is no need to use SimVim and the other Electrical Setup logic anymore.
Good Luck !
2022-04-25 14:34
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astrolivier76
Posts: 6
off course,

In fact, I havn't the memory have seen mobiflight when I start to create my modules and simvim (ardsim..) was for me the best solution.
Today I'm happy with my modules but it's right that I don't have a universal modules.

So, If i want to do that I must to do all from 0 because between the 4-wire bus and the multiplexers, it's impossible to do easyly the changes.

For info, I have:
- 1 MCP module,
- 1 FMC module,
- 1 EFIS module
- 1 radio panel module.
- 1 navigation radio module

So, you will understand that is imposible for me to made all modules with mobiflight!!

if we need just to cut and connect directy from my components OK, but no, it's more complicated with theses multiplexers.
And, for example, all max7219 are connected to a 4 wire pin with simvim, but it's impossible to connect in channel while with mobiflight yes, So 1 pin for my 6 displays modules.

Morever, for me it's was a best choice for my money ^^
-> 1 mega = 25€
-> 1 multiplexer = 2€

But it's right that your wiring diagram is accessible for all and it's more easy to wiring!! 1 component = 1 pin (or more) on the board,fewer errors are possible.

Olivier
2022-04-25 15:15
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giocc
Posts: 21
iconpizman82:

Hi
[...]
About Multiplexers.

Meanwhile we support the SimVim Guys by implement Output Shifter and Input Shifters within the last releases.
Also "Multiplexer" are available in the next Beta Release. ( System currently is tested in a close Alpha .... And will released as Beta next time)
BUT
Our Multiplexer Logic is planed for Buttons Only. So SimVim Stuff like controll 7Seg with Multiplexers or the base logic to handle multiple Arduinos as clients via one BAse Hub Arduino that is connected to computer.... this is not in planing for us.
Sounds hard.... We like to make a lot of things possible to the SimVim Users and allow them a easy start with MF.... We try to implement some new things so your hardware is more compatible. But we not fully change our logics to be compatible with SimVim. At the end some rework of Hardware will be needed to fit the MF requirments.



Hi, sorry to come late to the party. But as, albeit unmentioned, sole developer (and advocate, for the benefit of people that have invested lots of work in building SimVim-compatible cockpits) of the whole multiplexer support, I think I can have a say in the matter, and also rectify a few details.

First of all, support for shift registers per se is important but of limited use for SimVim users (they are used for LED drivers only - and BTW that includes the HC595 ICs).

Second, for significant support, multiplexers for buttons are just the first required step. To cover most cases, the next step would be to allow MAX display drivers and output shift registers (and, while at it, also input shift registers) to be placed "behind" a multiplexer. Further steps are also possible to substantially increase compatibility, but I wouldn't go in depth here.

This does NOT require to "fully change our logics" - on the contrary, this feature (and a few others) could be implemented almost without any noticeable change in the logic, and with very reasonable effort. The only true hindrance is whether there is real interest from the MF team to support more devices or connection modes, basing on choices or preferences rather than actual technical difficulties.

After all, both shift registers and multiplexers had been shunned for a long time, but their introduction - besides not having been particularly hard - seems to have been more than welcome by many existing users, and also many potential others that would not have considered using MobiFlight yet.
2022-05-06 16:31
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astrolivier76
Posts: 6
icongiocc:

iconpizman82:

Hi
[...]
About Multiplexers.

Meanwhile we support the SimVim Guys by implement Output Shifter and Input Shifters within the last releases.
Also "Multiplexer" are available in the next Beta Release. ( System currently is tested in a close Alpha .... And will released as Beta next time)
BUT
Our Multiplexer Logic is planed for Buttons Only. So SimVim Stuff like controll 7Seg with Multiplexers or the base logic to handle multiple Arduinos as clients via one BAse Hub Arduino that is connected to computer.... this is not in planing for us.
Sounds hard.... We like to make a lot of things possible to the SimVim Users and allow them a easy start with MF.... We try to implement some new things so your hardware is more compatible. But we not fully change our logics to be compatible with SimVim. At the end some rework of Hardware will be needed to fit the MF requirments.



Hi, sorry to come late to the party. But as, albeit unmentioned, sole developer (and advocate, for the benefit of people that have invested lots of work in building SimVim-compatible cockpits) of the whole multiplexer support, I think I can have a say in the matter, and also rectify a few details.

First of all, support for shift registers per se is important but of limited use for SimVim users (they are used for LED drivers only - and BTW that includes the HC595 ICs).

Second, for significant support, multiplexers for buttons are just the first required step. To cover most cases, the next step would be to allow MAX display drivers and output shift registers (and, while at it, also input shift registers) to be placed "behind" a multiplexer. Further steps are also possible to substantially increase compatibility, but I wouldn't go in depth here.

This does NOT require to "fully change our logics" - on the contrary, this feature (and a few others) could be implemented almost without any noticeable change in the logic, and with very reasonable effort. The only true hindrance is whether there is real interest from the MF team to support more devices or connection modes, basing on choices or preferences rather than actual technical difficulties.

After all, both shift registers and multiplexers had been shunned for a long time, but their introduction - besides not having been particularly hard - seems to have been more than welcome by many existing users, and also many potential others that would not have considered using MobiFlight yet.



Hi Giocc,

thanks for your response and sorry for my delay of response.
I a agree with your comment.
you make a great job and I want to say to you a big thanks.
In my cockpit it's impossible for me to made new parts. I can't have a part for SIMVIM and an another part for FS.
So, I would like to have an only part for the two and the multiplexer is for me a great bonus.
All my parts are connected to my only board mega!! if I must to buy 4/5 mega it's more expensive that 10 multiplexers!!

So, if you can to add support encoder, potentiometer, rotary, stepper etc... with multiplexer then I will be a happy man :)

Olivier from France (sorry for my bad english)
2022-06-16 14:52
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slammer88
From: LTBJ, Turkey
Posts: 154
For this matter, I criticized the developers of SimVim back in time, I had the same intention in reverse (keeping my current config I use with Mobi and use it with SimVim), but he refused and said MUX is better. I then went to Air Manager, which has the same config as Mobi, only coding is necessary.
2022-06-23 14:43
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